The Loud Whisper Takeover
Featuring interviews with actors, stunts, dancers, filmmakers, action movie directors, athletes, Krav Maga teachers, acting coaches, and more.
Epic tales of changemakers, authentic personal stories, and top tips about the industry, the podcast is a treasure of knowledge helping storytellers of all kinds on their own journeys, and inspiring people to take action upon their own dreams.
Ever heard your inner voice getting louder and louder, urging you towards a new path? When our inner guidance starts to become so loud, we can no longer ignore it, and we MUST take action... This is often a time when life changes direction drastically. We are literally being called to take that leap of faith, make that phone call, write that script, make that film in other words, time to embrace our wildest dreams, shift gear, and grow exponentially.
Let's dive into the art of listening courageously to our inner compass. Because every one of us is destined to live a grand story and adventure while walking on planet Earth!
Headphones on, notebooks out, and buckle up!
Hosted by Cindy Claes.
The Loud Whisper Takeover
21: Landing an Acting Role on Netflix, Now What?
Remember the excitement around La Casa De Papel (also known as Money Heist) and its spin-off series Berlín? Netflix kept viewers on the edge of their seats with both shows, and Belgian actor Julien Paschal found himself in the spotlight after landing a role alongside Pedro Alonso, playing François Polignac.
Suddenly, Julien’s acting career gained massive attention. But how does an actor handle such a shift—both personally and professionally? While many actors dream of success, few are fully prepared for the intense realities that come with sudden fame. How do you manage the pressure, maintain boundaries, and leverage the exposure to propel your career forward?
In this episode, podcast host and action actress, Cindy Claes dives deep with Julien to explore these questions. Together, they unpack the challenges of stepping into the spotlight. So many actors miss the opportunity to use these opportunities as a springboard, and eventually only end up with some additional footage for their portfolio. How can an actor plan and strategise for success once you land a Netflix role?
Julien offers an honest look at the creative life's uncertainties and the rollercoaster hidden in the journey to success.
This episode also uncovers the role of media and PR in shaping an actor's career. Julien discusses the strategic importance of media engagement, the delicate handling of misinformation, and the impact of social media on public image.
With experience across both the film and music industry, Julien offers practical lessons for aspiring artists on staying authentic while seizing every opportunity.
Instagram Guest:
@julienpaschal
Host Instagram:
@cindy_claes
Want to send Cindy Claes a DM?
Podcast Intro Review
Let's continue the conversation on Instagram:
Cindy Claes - Host
@cindy_claes
Loud Whisper VZW - Producers
@loudwhispervzw
Join the community:
Buy Me A Coffee VIP Zone
Welcome to the Loud Whisper Takeover podcast. As you know by now, I'm an action actress and a filmmaker on my own journey of trying to make it happen. So today we're going to talk to a very special guest about what happens when, all of a sudden, you're in the spotlight. All of us actors, that's what we want, like landing that big role. But really and truly, how do you handle that on a personal level? Then there are so many other questions. Can you leverage the opportunity that you just had so that more doors can open? But how do you handle it on a personal level, on a professional level? Because more success also comes with more responsibilities, more problems or different problems to solve. So today we have a special guest responsibilities, more problems or different problems to solve. So today we have a special guest who is Belgian, a Belgian actor that made it big on Netflix. You have probably heard about a Netflix series called Berlin, and he played the role of François Polignac. Please welcome, julien Pascal. Hi, julien, how are you doing?
Speaker 2:Hi, cindy, I'm very good. Thanks for the invitation. I'm very happy to be here today.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm super excited to talk to you today about the topic, but also because you're also Belgian, like me, and so you have an international career and you are also, like, a multidisciplinary artist. So, on top of being an actor, please tell us more about you, about your world, your universe. What do you do as a creative being?
Speaker 2:Chronologically. I fell in love with music when I was a kid, especially with drums. I was just hypnotized. Each time I would see a drummer, a drum kit, a show on TV. I don't know how, because no one is really a musician or an artist in my family. My parents used to listen to good music, but no more than that, and I don't know.
Speaker 2:I started drumming when I was 13, after two years of hard work with my mother, who one day said okay, take your money that you received for your birthday and buy yourself a drum kit and leave me the fuck alone. So that day I found a drum kit in my little town in Belgium and we went and I had half the money. The girl wanted and I wanted it so bad that I negotiated and I think she was. She felt a little bit bad for me and she said okay, you can have it. So I went with my drum kit and it changed my life, cause from then I was just obsessed in my, in the cellar, in the, just playing all day long on Nirvana records and whatever records, and and from there I started playing in bands, in local bands in my little village, and when I was, I think, 18 or 19,. I got invited to an audition with a band in Brussels, an indie band that had a record deal with the label of Deus, that Belgian band which was very famous back in the days.
Speaker 1:I must say I don't, but please tell us what did the band, what kind of music did they do or what sort of genre were they in?
Speaker 2:Indie rock meets Tom Waits meets Captain Beefheart, that kind of blend, but it really. It was huge in the end of the 90s. It was a band from Antwerp and suddenly young musicians believed that they could make a career and that indie music could make sense and have success in Belgium. So it opened a whole new perspective. So I got hired by this band, played a few shows. I met musicians from Brussels, especially a guitar player named Turk Henri, and this guy started to play with another band called Schafko, and at some point Sch Sharko needed a drummer. So I started to play with them and little by little Sharko got some singles on the radio. We went from very small venues like 20 people to a full house I don't know 500, 700 audience in Brussels. And I've been playing with them for about 10 years, touring whole Europe, us, recording many albums.
Speaker 2:So that was my very first career. I was just obsessed with music and I just wanted to be a drummer. I didn't want to go to university, I just wanted to go to London at the Music Institute of yeah, mit Music Institute of Technology, where it's one year of intensive classes with the best. But when it was time to go my parents told me okay. No, we won't let you go to London. You're too young, drugs, whatever.
Speaker 2:So, out of despair, I didn't know what to do with myself. So I went to university to learn economics and after six months I was learning accountings for the exams. And I just said to myself what the fuck am I doing here, what? And I stopped that day I said to my parents I quit. And then I learned. I went to Louvain-en-Oeuvre to learn sound engineering at EAD, which is the only school in Belgium back in the days to have that kind of programs. And yeah, it was a compromise where I was still in the world of music, but with a real job somehow for the parents, with a real job somehow for the parents. So since then I've been working as a sound engineer, mixer, music producer. I had my own recording studio, I had my own label and publishing, and meanwhile I was still playing with bands and touring, and so it's been my life for 20 years, I think.
Speaker 1:And how did acting cross your path? Or when did that seed got planted?
Speaker 2:So, as I just told you before, I was very much into the music world as a being, as a musician or producer, mixer, engineer, whatever and since I was a kid, I really loved acting comedy, imitation, movies, shows. I was really fascinated by that and I never took any classes. I didn't dare. I like to be behind my drums, a little bit Hidden, but I didn't really feel like being front stage. I don't know why, but I moved to Barcelona in 2016 or 17 and I was a bit done with music. I still love music, but I was a bit fed up with the not with the music itself, but with what's around Spending an hour in a van to play one hour show and, yeah, I needed some change. So I moved to Barcelona and I didn't know anybody in the music world in Barcelona, but I missed a creative activity.
Speaker 2:So one day I was meditating. I used to go to a place in Gracia and meditate and do yoga every week with a great shaman, an American guy, lucas and one day I was meditating and it just came clear like okay, acting. And it just came clear like okay acting Because it had been there for a while and you always find excuses not to do it. No, it's not the right time, I have work to do, I'm too shy, whatever. So it had been in my mind for a long time and that day it was like, okay, I'm going to get out of this class, this meditation, and I'm going to go to acting classes Period. So that's what I did. I left there.
Speaker 2:I found some great improvisation classes in French in Barcelona, which was a great step because it was open to one of the actors or people working in business but who have problems speaking in public and that kind of stuff. So that was very nice as an introduction and I really liked it. So I did it for a few months and then I was. It was very nice, it opened my mind and made me figure out I wasn't that shy. And so from there I searched for other classes in Barcelona, but a little bit more demanding. So I just Googled acting classes English Barcelona and I found the Actors Workshop, which was luckily in Poblenou, really close to where I lived by the time. So I just contacted Frank Face, which is Belgian too, was Belgian as well.
Speaker 1:Yeah, frank, yeah, yeah, I know Frank.
Speaker 2:Yeah, okay. So I just met Frank and we said, okay, can start next week. So I started with Sam Meissner for a few months and then Chabot technique with Frank, which was very interesting. And what I missed in the improvisation classes is that, anything you do, they were like, oh, that was great, amazing, cool, which is nice to start with, but afterwards I needed someone telling me what the fuck are you doing? You should try this, try that, to be a little bit more challenged.
Speaker 2:And Frank offered that to me and gave me confidence to push it a bit further, and also some of my classmates. You get out of stage, you did your little scene and they're like, oh, that was really cool, I like this, that that's interesting when you do that. And you're like, oh, wow, cool, I like this, that that's interesting. When you do that, and you're like, oh, wow, cool, thank you, and it gave me some confidence. So from there I went to a first agency with, which was in Barcelona, face of Music and that's a music agency or that is a talent agency or an acting agency.
Speaker 2:Talent agency, mostly for commercials, but initially based on musicians. So if you need a drummer in a commercial, a trumpet player or a dancer or whatever it was in that niche. So I thought, okay, I'm a musician, so it makes sense. So we had a very good start together. I, my idea with going to a commercial agency was just initially to dare to just do a casting without being frightened like a rabbit. So that was the idea. So I signed with Face of Music. I wasn't out of the office they told me oh, you can go to a casting there, a casting there, a casting there. So it went really fast and chance of the beginner. I I got options or booked in a commercial like very quickly. I enjoyed it. It's fun to be on set to get some money. So I was really into it.
Speaker 2:And but I wanted to do fiction. So I left face of music, send a mail to our team management, met Chris and Natalia and they gave me a chance. And I'm very grateful for that, because when I went there I just I don't even know if I had a video book. Maybe I did a keynote and I had a video book, maybe I did a keynote and I had a few scenes where you could see me, just so I signed with them in 2019.
Speaker 2:And then, little by little, I got commercials with them and, little by little, small fiction castings. I got small parts in nice productions like Antidisturbios, the Rodrigo Sorogoyen, which is one of my favorite directors in the world. And, yeah, step by step, chris told me one day so the agent that you know from our team management, you don't build a house without foundations. Because I was like I was very innocent and said, okay, maybe, maybe I sign with them and tomorrow I have a great part. And she told me, ola, hold on, we need to build, go to classes, do your work and we'll see in the future.
Speaker 1:And so what is your world made of today? Because I totally relate to your journey, because I started in the world of dance and then I had a bit of a same thing as you. It's not, I was not done with dance, but there was something of me that wasn't being expressed in the world of dance. And so the world of acting and then film, and then camera, and then obviously now fighting for the camera, is part of my world. But then I'm coming, coming back to dancing a bit, but in a total different. My relationship with dance has changed. So what is your world made of now? Is it like, well, music was you know where I started and that's it chapter over. Or are you still in the world of music Like, where are you at energetically and where do you see yourself going, energetically speaking, you know, with your creative endeavors in general?
Speaker 2:music was my first love. I'm still in love with music and recently I a few months ago, I was like, oh my god, I would like to start playing in a band again. I miss it. It Because the drums, it's really something physical, and I figured out much later that why I was so fascinated by it when I was a teenager is when I was drumming. It was the only moment I wasn't thinking about anything else, I was just in the moment. If there is a snare hit, I'm there. I'm not thinking about the one before, the one after, I'm just into the now. I think it's what I'm looking for in all my experiences is just to be in the moment.
Speaker 2:So now today I'm working as a sound engineer, still as a mixer, but more for movie soundtracks or series or cartoons or whatever, because the music business has been since 20 years. It's just been going down the recording industry because people are not buying music anymore. So the budgets are smaller and smaller to go in the studio and at some point it was very difficult to have a recording studio and musicians. They don't have money to pay you. So while in the sound for image there is still an industry and budget. So I slowly moved to that part and it gives me a great flexibility about schedules because I'm a freelancer, so I can be off if I need to for shooting, for whatever, and I can work from anywhere. I have a mobile mixing setup. So as long as I have a good internet connection I can work from anywhere. I have a mobile mixing setup. So as long as I have a good internet connection I can work. So this is my main income activity.
Speaker 2:Let's say I want to go back into music as a musician and as a producer. I miss it and I would like to do it again. And, of course, acting. I want to keep on acting. But I realized, even though I had great opportunity with Berlin four or five years after my first acting class, which is amazing I realized that this acting world requires a lot of patience, that things come, but you have to be very patient. And it's not my first quality, I worked on it. But for me it's very important to have another regular activity like mixing for me for the moment. And if I have acting opportunities, great, amazing. But I don't have to get a job or a role or accept stuff I don't really care doing as an actor because I need, I just need the money.
Speaker 2:You know, I came from music because initially music was just a passion for me. But as my band got a little bit successful it became more like a job and when I started acting I just made a pact with myself, a deal with myself saying okay, the only rule in acting is that it has to be fun. For me, the process has to be fun. Rehearsing a scene, doing the casting, just this has to be fun, it's all I care about. Just to keep it like something a little bit special and not make it like a job in my head. You know, like oh shit.
Speaker 2:You know I realized that with music when I had to play the first time. I played venues like Ancienne Belgique in Brussels or Botanique in Brussels or Dour Festival, which when I was a teenager it was my dream. First time I did it I was just like over the moon. But the dance time I was not so much excited. I was like I'd rather stay home than go play in a muddy festival. So I realized that and I said, okay, I don't want to do the same with acting. I want to really use this experience and really take care of it as something special and and being professional, but not taking it mentally okay, it's my job, I have to do it. No, I want to do it.
Speaker 1:I, I'm happy to do it, it's fun thank you so much for sharing that because I just can relate to it so much. When I was a dancer and choreographer, but more of a dancer, yeah, I was living the dream as a dancer, but I said yes to so many jobs because you need the money and it was great I was living. You know, that was my income. But actually, how many of these dance jobs were really coming from the heart and from a place of, oh my God, this is what I want to do creatively speaking, and this is now well, actually, in these kind of dance jobs, well, they're just there because they bring me in money, but artistically speaking, they don't fulfill me. And I feel, going through this second creative career adventure chapter of life, whatever like I feel I'm finding that fun in action, acting, mixing movement, fighting and acting. And what I find also very inspirational about what you say is you share it very honestly, authentically and with a lot of transparency. Is you still have another income, but you are able to make an income from a creative activity that you love, but you still find a great balance of, hey, I'm still going to live my life in a fulfilling and aligned way, but my universe as a whole is going to be in the creative field and you land this big role as an actor.
Speaker 1:You're playing this role in the series of Netflix Berlin. Then you're being thrown into the spotlight, if I can say so, because Berlin was, you know, everybody was waiting for this series and you were invited on a huge amount of media platforms. So the first thing I want to ask you is how did you handle that emotionally? Because from the outside we could say, could say oh my God, he made it and look at this guy having all these interviews. But I'm sure that on a personal level, there must be highs, lows, fear, doubt.
Speaker 1:Actually, let's talk first about because I'm in a movie that is going to come out which is called Daniela Forever. I'm having a secondary role, but at the end of the day, as actors, we don't see the final edit until it's coming out, so we don't even know if the film or the series are going to be good. If we did actually a good job, because we know what we've done on set, then in post-production everything can change. How did you handle the first part, which is I had a blast on set and now I'm waiting for the final edit to come out? How did you handle that part?
Speaker 2:Oh, with a lot of doubts, because start from the casting call and do Go ahead. It's just to make it more chronological. So when I received the casting call for that series, I was really into okay, I need to make money because I was in a difficult situation. So in my mind I was okay acting. I'm open to commercials because it's quick money, easy money. But I don't have the time to do fiction because for a casting, for a fiction, casting first thing is required is okay. Okay, first learn the lines, do the job for the casting. So take time to do it, invest time and maybe you will have a job. So I was not really into that at the time. But I received that call without knowing for which project it was. I just knew it was for a great casting director, two great casting directors from Madrid who are Eva Leira and Yolanda Serrano Leira and Serrano and I had heard about them. I knew they were the casting directors of La Casa de Papel, alejandro Menabar, of Pedro Almodovar, and very nice projects. So I said, okay, I'm going to do it. La Casa de Papel, alejandro Menabar, of Pedro Almodovar, and very nice projects. So I said okay, I'm going to do it. And if I do it. I will just try to do it. Well, that's my philosophy. If I feel I don't have the time to prepare it and present something that I'm proud of, I prefer not to do it. So there, I took time and I said, okay, I'll try to do something nice. So at least they will call you back for another project, because if the first audition is terrible, they will not necessarily call you later. So I just did it. It was super nice.
Speaker 2:I did it from here in Zoom with one of the assistants, and the casting was so nice. It was like us talking now. There was no stress. I was prepared. I didn't say one word. That wasn't my script. I changed everything, took that risk because they just said that my character had to speak in Spanish, altered Spanish. So not a great accent, not great vocabulary, and my text, the text I received, was very good Spanish, and I felt I would never use these words naturally, these words naturally. So I kept the whole ideas but wrote them how I would say them normally, with mistakes, and so I did it like that, so a few times. And then they didn't know if the character would speak French, spanish, both, so I also improvised the scene in French. So they had both and it was a nice moment.
Speaker 2:And one month later I was in Brussels and Natalia, our agent, called me and said oh, good news, you got the part. But from there I had no idea if it was. I think by the time I knew it was Berlin, but I had no idea of the importance of the character If it was one day of shooting, two days. So Natalia called me and said oh, that's quite a recurring character and it would be at least 20, 25 days of shooting and you have to go to Madrid, like next week. And I was like what, what the hell? Great, it's amazing. So I just had to organize my planning for work, because I had work schedule that I had to cancel in order to go to Madrid. And so from there I flew to Madrid, met the whole production team, met some of the actors. It was great, it was super kind. And the first day Pedro Alonso came to my camerino and said Hola, bienvenido en la familia, que tal? It's going to be great, we're going to have a good time, we'll have good scenes together. And I was just like in a dream that day, you know, like whoa. So when they're for a week we did the process, what they call so it's finding the look of my character haircut, beard, costumes, et cetera, et cetera.
Speaker 2:I went back to Belgium or Barcelona, I don't remember and then I received my convocation for the first, for the first days of shooting, which were in Paris. And yeah, at the beginning I had to be honest, I had the imposter syndrome. Will it be okay? Am I going to screw up? You know, and I was doubting, so I called a few colleagues, acting colleagues who are more experienced than me and who said you know, it's totally normal, what's your feeling? I felt the same, that feeling that on the shoot, on the set, you have the feeling that someone's going to come and say, hey, sorry, it was a mistake, casting mistake, someone did a mistake, but you can go home, you know what I'm talking about, what I'm talking about. But the whole team was so kind and nice on the human level that it went away very quickly, that feeling, that imposter syndrome.
Speaker 2:But when we finished shooting, so the whole shooting was, I think, nine months, the whole shoot of the series. So I had to go for four days here, three days there, maybe one day here. I did my last scene at the end of May. So I was supposed to go back to Brussels and so I said goodbye to everybody. You know on set they do. It was the last day of Julian. Then you have the whole set clapping and the director coming and I received a big gift from the producer. So it was really wow moments I would never forget.
Speaker 2:So I was ready to leave and one of the producers came to me and said oh, by the way, we're going to do a vision of the first episode at Netflix in three days with the main cast and we'd love you to be there.
Speaker 2:Okay, sure. So they changed my flights and I went to see the first episode next to the Pedro Alonso, the main cast, the technicians and nobody had seen anything until then. So it was fantastic. But I still thought, or feared, that all my sequences would be cut and would not be part of the final editing, or that it would be terrible and that my career would be over as an actor, because you don't see anything. You just do a scene one, two, three times and you're just like okay, I start to feel it now and they're already okay, next scene, it's done, okay, we have it, and so you just have to trust everybody. So I learned a lot, a lot, and as my character was talking in some scenes in spanish, but in other scenes in french, I asked the production or or the agency if I could dub myself in french because I speak french. I would find it ridiculous to have someone else dubbing me in French.
Speaker 1:Oh, what a great, what a great idea that you had there, Because obviously on Netflix everything is being translated in other languages.
Speaker 2:I mix a lot of dubbing, french dubbing. So I know that world, I've been in that world a lot. I learned a lot also because I was. I've been recording thousands of hours of French dubbing. So you just basically have an actor in front of a microphone just acting with his voice. So I think during these years I just learned also by just by watching and listening actors all day long practicing in front of a microphone. So long story short.
Speaker 2:I went to Paris a few months later to dub my scenes that were in Spanish, to dub them in French. So, and then I said I, so I saw some of my scenes and I was okay, you can sleep, you can. It's not perfect, of course, but you don't have to be ashamed of what you did. And then after that there was the big release party in Madrid, which luckily I've been invited to Because at the end of the day, my character was number eight in the call sheets.
Speaker 2:You know, for those who don't know, I just discovered it too. But, like for Berlin, actor number one is Pedro Alonso. Number two, three, four, five, six is his band. Number seven was Samantha Camilleille, my wife in the series, and number eight was me. So I got invited to everything red carpet, uh, photo, protocols with the, with the core team so it was like amazing. But I took it with a distance, because this night of the premiere they invited me to an amazing hotel in a palace in Madrid, but the night before I was couch surfing at a friend's place, you know, and the night after I was in a youth hostel or whatever you know.
Speaker 1:So I I took everything like an experience, but with some distance thank you so much for sharing the reality check you know, and uh, and the authentic, uh, transparent realities behind the scenes. So I have a question about this big launch party. What is happening with a series? Because obviously you saw episode one a few months prior to that, but when there is the official hey, everybody's coming together because the series are going to launch. Are you binge watching every single episode together? Or like, how does that actually? How does that work? Did you binge watch all the episodes by yourself in the couch at home, or does that happen at the party, like you're going to watch every single episode together as a team?
Speaker 2:So the party was? It was amazing. It was. They put a lot of efforts and money in it. It was a Netflix party in a beautiful place in Madrid, I think they set up. There was one cinema in that place with the cast and there was another room for another audience with headphones. And I think. No, we only saw the first episode again, nothing more. And then party, concert, food, photo shoots, whatever.
Speaker 1:So obviously the series had a huge amount of success. Like I'm a bit like I've had a papel fan, I'm a big fan of Berlin as well. It's just, yeah, I got hooked and addicted and a big part of the world was hooked and addicted. So then you got invited to a lot of platforms to speak about your role, your acting career. You've been put in the spotlight also on French speaking platforms, so in Belgium and in France. So how did you navigate that? Because, obviously, being put in the spotlight all of a sudden, I personally think that we should all be equipped for that, professionally speaking, but also on a personal level to manage fears and excitements, doubts. How did all of that happen for you?
Speaker 2:Once again. When Natalia told me I had the role, I had the part I just thought, oh my God, it's great as an actor, I had the parts. I just thought, oh my God, it's great as an actor. My God, I will have the opportunity to, to act in, to act with Pedro Alonso. Imagine. He's been doing that for 35 years. He's an amazing actor. He's done a lot of different things. It's a great opportunity and I just thought about it and it's more.
Speaker 2:I just told it to a few friends, close friends, family, because there are confidentiality, blah, blah, blah. So you, you cannot, you don't want to talk too much about it, but it's mainly my friends. Some friends would tell me oh my God, it's related to La Casa de Papel, so you're going to have a zillion of Instagram followers. I thought, oh, oh yeah, I didn't think about that. Maybe, I don't know, I'm not too much into social networks. I'm from an older generation.
Speaker 2:I knew the world without internet. It's not very natural for me. But I thought, oh yeah, maybe that's right, very natural for me. But I thought, oh yeah, maybe that's right because, yeah, when you look at the profiles of actors from La Casa de Papel, they have a lot of followers and so I understood it was very important today. But for some people it was almost more important to get you know, I was just happy to have that job as an actor and for some people it was the other way around. It was like, oh, it's great to have that job because you will have many Instagram followers, as if Instagram was the goal, the purpose. Because if Instagram was the the, the goal, the purpose.
Speaker 1:Because if Instagram was the, was the new award sort of thing or number of followers?
Speaker 2:But before the release I thought, okay, let's be honest, it's a very, it's an international project, you know, on on December 29th, it's it's very funny, on December 29th, it's very funny. It's really weird to say, okay, it's released now in the whole world. It's not just my country, spain, no, it's the world, it's Netflix. So I thought that kind of opportunities of exposition are not that frequent. What do you say Frequent, frequent, yeah.
Speaker 2:So I said maybe it would be the moment to have some PR help from public relation, press relation people who do that as their job, because maybe it's now or never, you know, on an exposure level. So I contacted a press agency in in in Madrid, a few months actually, and one of them, which was Gran Via Comunicacion, which is also, which also takes care of, uh, el Profesor and La Casa de Papay, were the first to answer saying oh, yeah, sure, we'd be happy to work with you. So we had a few phone calls and just discussed how we could do it, how many months, how much it would cost, because at that point I'm paying that. I'm paying for that personally, because I don't think I say anything. I cannot say now secrets.
Speaker 2:But now Netflix promoted the series. Of course berlin and his band, so just the six actors, that's it. So I thought it would make sense to try to invest a little bit of money and see where it goes, because I thought if I don't do it I might, might regret it. So at least I did it and learned on that whole part, which is more promotion, trying to have an image, trying to get your name in nice magazines, in nice interviews, and try to build a career with the medias too, because nowadays you have to play with the media.
Speaker 1:And so it's this company in Madrid that you worked with throughout the whole PR campaign, or did you have different, because obviously you had a lot of interviews in Belgium and in France as well? Were they in charge of making that happen, or did you also work with Belgian or French PR agency?
Speaker 2:This agency from Madrid took care of all the Spanish medias and also in Latin America Because they had connections as they worked for Alvaro Morte, a professor. They already had good connections with the medias that liked the universe of La Casa de Papel, you know. So I got a few interviews in Argentina, mexico, in the US through them and for Belgium. I met through a friend, pr in Brussels, rodrigue, who used to be an agent in Paris and who had been doing like PR work for artists in Belgium and also he was also doing the promotion of movies, when there were some movies for Sony or I don't know when they got released in Belgium. And now he's also doing the promotion of HBO Max that's just been released in Belgium. So, ahmed Rodrig, we talked and he said, ok, I'm going to help you and we had a deal.
Speaker 2:I was super surprised of the amount of interviews I got in Belgium. It was crazy. I didn't expect that at all. I expected a few interviews here and there, but at some point it got. Yeah, many people wanted to interview me because I was a bit known in Belgium as an indie drummer Back in the days. I had some press and interviews and stuff as an indie drummer back in the days. I had some press and interviews and stuff with my bands back in the days. So the people, the journalists, were like how the fuck is a Belgian Brussels indie drummer in La Casa de Papel? We missed something. So they wanted to know that. So I got invited to many things and it was great.
Speaker 2:I learned a lot also about how to behave and how to deal with the media. Some people you can trust, some people you have to be careful what you say, that kind of stuff. So it's always I love to learn. So it's. I learned a lot about that. I just realized also that I also have friends who are journalists. I had one of my girlfriends was journalist back in the day. So it's a world.
Speaker 2:I know a little bit, but I realized that when you meet a journalist, he's doing his job, he has to go back with something to give to his chief to write. So you have to be generous to give them something because they need it. But you have to find the boundaries in what you want to talk about, what you don't want to talk about. And most of the experience were great and some of the journalists, the reporters became friends in Belgium or in Spain too, but some of them not so much like, for example. It's a stupid example, but so I got quite.
Speaker 2:I think it was January. February of this year was full in Belgium. I had stuff all the time like national newspapers, national TV news, like you know, les Infos du Trésor, which is like the most watched program in the country, that kind of things. But at some point it became it got a little bit crazy. Not crazy, but I saw a side of journalism that I don't like and that I want to avoid in the future, which is more the gossip, gossip press and that kind of shit.
Speaker 1:Please allow me to bounce back on several things you've said. The first thing I want to bounce back on, which I find fantastic, is that you took charge of your career. You were like, hey, I need to make, I need to leverage this opportunity, which I feel is where I'm at right now. This movie is coming out with a big director's name attached with the lead actor, is also quite famous and all my scenes are with him. Where I'm at right now, this movie is coming out with a big director's name attached with the lead actor, is also quite famous and all my scenes are with him.
Speaker 1:Obviously, I don't know what the final edit is going to be about. Like I don't know yet, and you know same things. My heart is beating because I'm like, okay, once I'm going to see the film, we'll see. But I want to leverage the opportunity when this film comes out, because I'm thinking otherwise, it's going to become just a couple of images that I'm going to add to my video book, my video reel. And then I'm going to ask my agent you know, hey, let's try and open more doors.
Speaker 1:And I'm like, no, I need, there must be something that I can do as an actress to open more doors, but also doors that obviously are in alignment with where I want to go. So I'm asking you, as an actress that is a couple of years behind of where you're at right now with your career this film is coming out what would be your top tip in regards to finding a PR agency? What should I keep in mind when looking for one? So I understand that there is a budget that will need to be allocated, but how would you, if you were in my position, when should I take those actions? Should I wait until the film comes out and then take those actions? Should I start looking for a PR agency now, and how should I make my decision with which PR agency to work with?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's a Spanish production. It was filmed in Spain.
Speaker 1:it's a Spanish production, or it was filmed in Spain. It's a Spanish director, but it's a co-production between the United States, spain and Belgium, and so the lead actor was American.
Speaker 2:Okay, and where is it? Is it going to be released in all those territories, or more?
Speaker 1:Yeah, apparently, yes, yes, like I'm still waiting for certain confirmations, as you know, sometimes we're not being, you know, communicated the full picture when you're not the lead actor, so I'm still waiting for your second things and where do you see you working most in the future?
Speaker 2:more belgium, US.
Speaker 1:I've always lived in different countries and I'm happy to pack my bag whenever I speak four languages English, french, dutch and my Spanish is okay, but not perfect. I'm a Spanish actress with a really thick accent and if I'm asked to improvise I will make a lot of grammatical mistakes, but if I have a script I can learn it, so I think I could eventually work in various markets. I would love to leverage the opportunity both for me as an actress and have more roles that I would be interested in and also as a filmmaker, because I'm thinking, if I want to ask for investors, for money, for grants or anything to make my own films, having a credit somewhere can also maybe help me in that direction.
Speaker 2:I'm asking because I thought a lot about it after investing some money in PR, because I was really broke. But I told myself, okay, fuck it, you will find the money, do it, Otherwise you will regret it. And I didn't really have any one. I knew that I could ask oh, have you done it? What did you think? So I was. I just had to believe my, my intuitions about that and it was a great experience on a human level.
Speaker 2:The people in Madrid from Gran Via Irene is Carino. He's great. She was super nice to me. She told me how to do how it works when you have a I don't know an online interview, that you have to try not to look like shit, have some nice lights, be prepared a little bit. So I learned that with her. She came to me with. She came with me to the premiere in Madrid because Napalier couldn't come. So she also introduced me to people. She connected me with nice suit brands for the premiere, got me interviews. It was very interesting. So it's nice. Now I have a lovely article in Esquire Spain. I have a few nice stuff, but if I had to redo it today, I think I would invest money in a community manager for the social medias because it's much more impactful nowadays than articles physical articles, I think and I'm terrible at social medias. I played the game of being very present on social medias when Berlin came out, but it's I don't't like doing that, to be honest. So if I had to do it, I would invest that.
Speaker 1:If I had to do it again, I would invest that money in a social media master once you've come into the public eye or in the spotlight, there are other things you have to handle. It's not just your friends that are started like your post and comment on it, but, for example, I would really would like to try and reach the media, as in having articles or being interviewed on certain platforms, just to have a wider reach. So I guess, in that terms, you don't regret to have invested in it.
Speaker 2:So how did you select the press agencies you worked with? Because I had heard about it, about them as the best ones, the first ones to do PR for actors and cinema in Madrid, because it's, I think, in other countries it's been there for a while, but here in Spain it's quite new, and Gran Via was one of the first ones to do it. They had worked with El Profes, a professor, so I was confident and they were the only ones to answer, like the same day or the day after maybe. I got some answers a few weeks later from the other ones, but I said, okay, it's the only one interested or answering, so let's check with them.
Speaker 2:And we called, we had a good, the human side was was nice, because you have to feel confident too, and so we worked a few months together and it was like a fee for the whole stuff, and so they know the strategy to, to which strategy to use. So we started working a few months before Berlin was released, just in order to, because no one heard about me before, especially in Spain. So you have to prepare a little bit, send a first press note. Second one do some follow-up to slowly get interviews and have these interviews published around the release of the series. So there are some work. There was some work to do before the release in order to have results after the release, if you want.
Speaker 1:And because the whole campaign was also linked to berlin, the series on netflix. Are there any agreements that need to be put in place with netflix or where you're totally independent, in terms of, once the series are released, you can go and have interviews like you wanted? Or did you need permissions?
Speaker 2:yes, yeah, I know what you mean, but luckily so. Irene, who did, uh, the press for me in spain from granville, knows the head of promo in for from netflix spain. It's a small world, so I think she told her okay, okay, I'm going to take care of Julien for his promotion, do you agree? Do you want? Are you going to do something with him? Blah, blah, blah. So do you have material that we can use, like pictures from the set and stuff? So they had they communicated. I know I was not doing anything that would make Netflix angry, because you don't want to have a fight with Netflix, do you?
Speaker 1:So obviously your press agency was well connected, and so there are agreements that are being put in place, like on that sort of level. You also asked me, hey, cindy, where, in which country, in which market you want to work. You worked with somebody in Belgium, rodrigue, and then you worked with Gran Via in Spain that was promoting you on the Spanish media and in Latin America. Which one, looking back at it now, was the most worth for you, not in regards of the work of the agencies, but more in terms of where you want to go, in which countries you want to open doors? Would you have done exactly the same if you were to do it again, or would you spend more money or more time or energy in the belgian side of things or the french market? Or, yeah, would you have made different choices there?
Speaker 2:well, I think I would do about the same, because Spain is where I started acting and where I worked the most as an actor until today. And, funny enough, I never really worked for France, although French is my mother tongue and I don't have an agent in Paris. But the French people from Paris, they have a very good image from Belgians. Professionally, we have a good reputation. I could sense that with music. When I was playing drums in indie bands, we would go to Paris and they were like oh, we love Belgian bands, you're so special, you're so kind, you're so special, you're so kind, you're so nice. So it's like a French speaking Belgium is like a more relaxed, more chilled French. So I could use that in order to try to find an agency in France. So that was useful, although agencies don't really look well, they look more to a video book than your press releases. But well, it gives an idea of where you are.
Speaker 2:And I had to invest. It was an investment, strong money. I didn't have to make it and, yeah, it's an investment on your career. And at that moment I thought I could invest money in more acting classes or in a new photo shoot or whatever. But I think now it would be wise to invest it in some promotion and that I learned this from the music, because it's the same. When you're in a band you can release a great album. If no one hears about it nothing will happen, or unless sometimes it happens. But I've seen I recorded some great albums and then, with a lot of efforts of all the musicians, and then you see the release, they do a little concert and no one talks about it anymore because there was no promotion, there was no marketing plan and it's very sad. I was aware of the marketing or promotion side of what we do, of artistic activities.
Speaker 1:And then I would love to bounce back on what you said about your experiences with the interviews that they were mostly positive, but a few were a bit I don't know maybe didn't feel aligned or that sort of things. What sort of top tips would you give to any actor that is being interviewed by the media in order to be prepared? Because obviously, we cannot go into these interviews with a very innocent mind saying, hey, I'm just going to talk about really positive things here. Obviously, journalists are looking for maybe the spicy things or something that they can spin into some sort of story or headline that could be positive or not, some sort of story or a headline that could be positive or not. So what would be a top tip in order to be prepared for these interviews? Feel grounded and have your boundaries yeah being very clear in your head prior to the interview.
Speaker 2:If possible, know a little bit who you're going to meet. Usually in Spain, irene would tell me okay, you have an interview with that person, don't worry it. An interview with that person, don't worry, it's a very kind person, it's going to be an interview about acting, blah, blah blah. So you get like a briefing before. And in Belgium also, rodrigue would tell me okay, this journalist is really about art, culture, blah, blah, blah. Go there very relaxed.
Speaker 2:And some others was like okay, the newspapers they're writing for they might try to get some private life infos, or so be careful with that. So you think about it before you go and you have some mental boundaries. For example, me, I didn't want to talk about my private life because I'm very, I'm not secret, but yeah, it's my private life and I'm not an exhibitionist. So I was very, very clear about that mentally. So I think the first interview I did was for L'Officiel Homme and she says in the interview that very funnily. But she says that she tried to have some information but that I was like it was impossible to get it Because I was like no, I have confidentiality stuff I signed with Berlin and I don't want to talk about my private life. So these, I was like, sorry, I don't talk about this, so that was fun. But yeah, I just had one or two bad experiences. So, yeah, my advice would be I try to apply it now. I don't say a fucking word about a project, even if it's been shot, I've been paid, whatever, until it's released, or until I'm sure I'm in the final edit that's a lesson I learned least or until I'm sure I'm in the final edit. That's a lesson I learned. Nothing very dramatic, but I think.
Speaker 2:After, after I shot Berlin, I got a casting call from RT management for Zorro. There was a French series shot in Spain with Jean Jardin as Zorro. So I was working a lot as a mixer, so I did quick self tape. It was for a small part, so so I did a quick self-tape. It was for a small part, so I did it really quickly, sent it poof and I don't know, 10 days later the agency told me oh yeah, you've been selected, so we're waiting for the shooting dates. Oh, cool, but I knew it was going to be one day, two days maybe, and I think I told it to a journalist that became friend, just maybe I told it to a journalist that became friend, just maybe I'm going to shoot in Zorro, but I'm not sure. It's the day after someone unknown phone number calls me on my phone, I was like oh yeah, my name is blah blah blah.
Speaker 2:I'm a journalist at this newspaper, a newspaper from my hometown, and we've heard that you were going to shoot in Zorro. I said, look man, I yeah, I did the casting. I might do it, but it's not sure. I don't have any information, I don't know. So let's make a deal, If you want, I call you back when I have information, Because now I don't know that very day that the next day he published, julien pascal of berlin is gonna feature in zorro with jean du jardin, for that newspapers on their website. And then there another newspaper, which is the same kind of shitty newspaper, gossip newspaper, also put that information on their website. Then Paris Match put it on their website. Then I don't know another magazine put it, because they're concurrent. So if you publish an info I have to publish it too, because we're concurrent.
Speaker 2:Competitors, competitors, yeah to publish it too, because we're competitors, competitors, yeah. So I was like, okay, be very careful with what you say, because it doesn't really matter, because and the end of the story is that I didn't have news for zoro and I met one of the belgian co-producers at a party in Brussels. I got introduced to him and I said, oh, you're working on Zorro, I'm going to shoot a scene in Zorro, I guess. I said, yeah, for what part? He said you know it's for this part. And he told me, no, it's done, we shot it. I said, oh, okay, that kind of things happen, especially for small parts.
Speaker 2:I don't know what happened. I think there were strikes with French technicians, so they had changed the plans, so they just shot it with someone else, no biggie. But I think yesterday my brother asked me again when is Zorro released? And I told him for the 10th time I'm not in that fucking theory. It's a lie, it's fake news, so it's not very important. But I'm quite honest and I like truth. So I don't really like that kind of gossips, false information.
Speaker 2:And yeah, at the time I had a girlfriend. My girlfriend was in Brussels. She's a journalist on TV and radio, she's like Miss Cinema for RTBF, the French-Belgian public radio and TV, and I don't know. At some point some of these journalists heard about it. So we were like in that kind of press, oh, ee Mullen is with Berlin's actor Julien Pascal, blah, blah, blah, like in the gossip pages, which is it's not my world. So I'm pretty sure not to be into that kind of things. It's funny. It's funny when it happens, like what the fuck? I mean on the gossip bait. But yeah, you have to be cautious with that.
Speaker 1:Thank you for the warning. Thank you for the warning because I think obviously they were not like major things, but these things can quickly get out of hand and maybe have an impact on people's personal lives or their professional lives, and so I think it's quite important that we are being warned, as actors, to pay attention to it. At the end of all this investment and stuff, was it worth it to have invested that money into a PR campaign? Do you feel like doors have opened, even though I know I've been doing a little bit of research, obviously, on how to measure the impact of a PR campaign and sometimes it's only years later that you can see the impact of it. It's not like, hey, here we've got statistics, we've had that many articles and that many doors opened, or whatever. But do you feel, generally speaking, that it has opened doors and that it was worth it, or do you think actually it was more about the learning experience rather than opening doors?
Speaker 2:Both experience rather than opening doors both. I cannot really measure the impact of the the pr stuff, but I learned a lot. So for the learning curve it was very interesting and I think it's yeah, it's more something about the long term and building a career, building an image, building something. It takes time but yeah, I think it can open doors. I'm not very into the commercial partnerships, but there is a cloth brand I really like since I'm a kid. It's St James. It's very classical navy jerseys, like the sailors from Brittany. It's been there for 100 years and I met someone who was working with them. They gave me some cloth because I could send, like a press how do you call that Press release, a dossier press. It helps. I'm talking to an agent, nice agency in Paris for the moment I think I send them some links to my interviews, but I also send my video book and my CV. It's part of the whole thing. But I cannot say, okay, this interview brought me that job. It doesn't work like this.
Speaker 1:Perhaps it has opened doors in regards to commercial endorsement possibilities for sponsorship. If you wanted to pursue that conversations, perhaps with other agents. Do you feel it eventually got you into certain castings? Do you feel you have more fiction castings or more interesting roles after the PR campaign? Do you feel it had an impact on that?
Speaker 2:I, yeah, in Belgium, yes, because, as in Belgium, there is no agents, so it gave me some spotlight towards the Belgian casting directors who didn't invite me. They didn't know about me before and now they invite me to castings, so it's a good thing, but it could be very small parts. Yeah, no, it doesn't really change anything on that level for now, with big productions, it doesn't change anything, but it helped for more, maybe more indie projects or things that are in development, projects or things that are in development, but yeah, where I get very nice proposals, but it's in development. So will it happen or not?
Speaker 1:I don't know thank you so much, julian, for this really authentic and transparent interview. Like I feel, I learned so much and I also feel way more prepared as an actress, you know for what might coming, hopefully come my way in the next few months as well. Can you just share with us a mantra that you have at the moment, because obviously you've gathered a lot of experience in the arts and you have, I'm sure, as a human being, you've transformed a lot over the last few experiences. What is your current mantra that you keep in mind?
Speaker 2:to stay grounded and to move forward I have a few ones one day at a time is one of my mantras out of my life experience. I'm not very good at making plans and seeing months or years ahead. I try to be in the moment as much as possible, whatever I do, to be conscious. So it's also life discipline, because in order to be conscious, you have to take care of yourself, of your mind, of your health, feelings, drugs, alcohol, whatever Part of the journey. And yeah, I'm very much, yeah, it's related to that.
Speaker 2:But I really try to be as conscious as possible and as connected to my guts as possible and trust my guts, because many times in the past I didn't really listen to my guts and afterwards I said why the I didn't really listen to my guts? And afterwards I said why the fuck didn't I listen to myself? I knew it, I knew, I knew that somewhere in myself I knew. But you say no, you mentalize it a lot and you say no, it's going to be all right, no problem. And then after, after, yeah, you realize you, your intuition was right. So I really try to connect with that amazing, amazing.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for your grounded spirit and for your openness during this interview. Thank you so much, julian well, pleasure.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for yeah, it's. I think it's the first time I talk about all this and it's interesting because it's been a journey and it's nice to share it. And actually one of my we're very good friends now with Rachel Lascar, who plays she has the role of Commissaire Lavelle in Berlin, the French police woman, berlin, the French police woman. We were friends before and we are very close now and she's way. She's much more experienced than I am. She's been acting for years. She has an amazing curriculum, but she never did the promo work and she saw me doing it, we talked about it and she worked with the same agency too. At the end of the day, oh amazing yeah, yeah, because she, yeah.
Speaker 2:We were just talking and I said I think with your, with the career you have, you people need to know, at the end of the day, if my journey can be an inspiration for one person. It all makes sense to me. When I was drumming a lot, a kid once came to me. I knew him since he was a kid and now he was 22. He became an amazing drummer, way better than I was. He studied jazz and classical percussions and stuff. But one day he told me I decided to become a drummer because when I was 10 or 12, I saw you playing. To me that's the most valuable reward.
Speaker 1:I definitely think that during this interview, we brought light to a topic that is never really talked about, which is that transition from just being an artist to the spotlight is here. I learned so much, and so thank you so much for empowering myself and also all the people that will be listening to this podcast.
Speaker 2:My pleasure and thank you. Thank you very much.
